Tuesday, July 21, 2009

Atheists - winning since 33 A.D.

Epicurus nailed it almost 2000 years ago.
Posted by The Atheist Missionary at 4:11 PM
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9 comments:

  1. epicurus is the shiz! i can't imagine saying something that profound that it is repeated a couple millenia from now.

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  2. Epicurus was one of the very first philosophers to stress that gods neither reward nor punish humans. Some felt that such a belief was miserable. How ironic, since Epicurus was a great proponent of doing whatever it takes to achieve true happiness.

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  3. The only real problem with that quote is that the earliest place I it seems to have showed up is in the works of David Hume. Believe you me, I'd love it if Epicurus said it. And, the fact is, it doesn't matter whether or not it was said by an old Roman dude, since it's fundamentally true. But I have searched and searched and the earliest reference I can find to that specific quote is in Hume.

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  4. Geds, this is what the far from infallible Wikipedia has to say about the surviving works of Epicurus:

    The only surviving complete works by Epicurus are three letters, which are to be found in book X of Diogenes Laertius' Lives of Eminent Philosophers, and two groups of quotes: the Principal Doctrines, reported as well in Diogenes' book X, and the Vatican Sayings, preserved in a manuscript from the Vatican Library.

    Numerous fragments of his thirty-seven volume treatise On Nature have been found among the charred papyrus fragments at the Villa of the Papyri at Herculaneum. In addition, other Epicurean writings found at Herculaneum contain important quotations from his other works.

    I have no idea whether the quote in question is contained in any of the sources referred to above. However, you can rest assured that David Hume didn't make it up.

    You could always go searching at the Vatican and tell them that TAM sent you.

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  5. Oh, trust me, I've read a lot of Epicurus and I don't doubt that he would have agreed with that sentiment. There's another option that the particular quote is buried somewhere in the works of someone like Cicero, who could have said, "Did not Epicurus say..." then gone on to argue the Stoic philosophy against ol' Epicurus.

    It's especially problematic since we know so much of Epicurus's work was destroyed. I've just never found the original quote anywhere and it almost seems like it didn't exist until Hume asserted it.

    Although I might have to take you up on that offer for a letter of introduction to the Vatican...

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  6. @ Stef - Maybe 2000 years from now someone will quote "epicurus is the shiz!" - Stef 2009

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  8. Is an Atheist "anti god" or just opposed to faith? Curious why in the direction I take down the Christian road, I do not mention your belief nor do my peers. But very often I run across a site such as this and see the Atheists referring to my faith as silly. I also see many times in a site such as these the Atheists pursuing a reason to justify their belief or lack of. Would it make more sense to quietly take your position and live your life as most Christians do? Please do not mistake my question as one of sarcasm. I really am just curious. Thanks Vance

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  9. The quote is interesting and I'm pretty sure that most "believer" would have a hard time with it since most believe in God being sovereign in all things but they replace sovereinty for "control" and this is the problem. The Bible says that God makes promises and that he would not break them - he is bound by his own word. Human's liberty is one of those promises.

    So God is not omnipotent since he chose not to be to protect our free will.

    Makes senses?

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